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Jair Jurrjens and Martin Prado

Re: Jair Jurrjens and Martin Prado

PostPost #16 by ofahn » December 16th, 2011, 1:13 pm

TuckerBlair89 wrote:I also think it could simply be that he is the most tradeable and valuable piece they have


I wish our FO would understand that sentence describes Adam Jones.
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Re: Jair Jurrjens and Martin Prado

PostPost #17 by Tucker Blair » December 16th, 2011, 1:15 pm

ofahn wrote:
TuckerBlair89 wrote:I also think it could simply be that he is the most tradeable and valuable piece they have


I wish our FO would understand that sentence describes Adam Jones.

I'm with you on that. At this point, I would not even care if they put Angle in CF for an entire year to see what he can do. Bat him leadoff (assuming Roberts is essentially toast at this point).
funny thing is, I was not an advocate of Angle at first.
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Re: Jair Jurrjens and Martin Prado

PostPost #18 by ofahn » December 16th, 2011, 1:23 pm

TuckerBlair89 wrote:I'm with you on that. At this point, I would not even care if they put Angle in CF for an entire year to see what he can do. Bat him leadoff (assuming Roberts is essentially toast at this point).
funny thing is, I was not an advocate of Angle at first.


Angle reminds me of a player that plays beyond his talent.

I met him in AZ when I went to an AFL game in 2009. I made the trip to see Josh Bell but came away most impressed with Angle. He had a HORRIBLE game at the plate but he admitted that and explained what he had learned and how he would try to fix it. He WANTS to be a ML player. I just knew at that point that he would make it to the bigs and I was glad to see that he did.

I really think giving him a chance will surprise some people.
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Re: Jair Jurrjens and Martin Prado

PostPost #19 by Tucker Blair » December 16th, 2011, 1:26 pm

ofahn wrote:
TuckerBlair89 wrote:I'm with you on that. At this point, I would not even care if they put Angle in CF for an entire year to see what he can do. Bat him leadoff (assuming Roberts is essentially toast at this point).
funny thing is, I was not an advocate of Angle at first.


Angle reminds me of a player that plays beyond his talent.

I met him in AZ when I went to an AFL game in 2009. I made the trip to see Josh Bell but came away most impressed with Angle. He had a HORRIBLE game at the plate but he admitted that and explained what he had learned and how he would try to fix it. He WANTS to be a ML player. I just knew at that point that he would make it to the bigs and I was glad to see that he did.

I really think giving him a chance will surprise some people.

I hope so. I would love for him to prove me wrong. As a former CF in HS and College, I love his type of defensive play.
But I wouldn't expect it this year. I highly doubt they are trading Jones. Maybe he gets some time in LF though. I would enjoy that too, having Davis and Reimold DH and Reimold play LF a couple days a week as well.
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Re: Jair Jurrjens and Martin Prado

PostPost #20 by A_K » December 16th, 2011, 2:09 pm

I see nothing of substance to get excited about with Angle. But, I'm still fine with him getting extensive playing time this year to find out for sure.
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Re: Jair Jurrjens and Martin Prado

PostPost #21 by ofahn » December 16th, 2011, 2:27 pm

A_K wrote:I see nothing of substance to get excited about with Angle. But, I'm still fine with him getting extensive playing time this year to find out for sure.


Unless someone clones Babe Ruth, Cy Young,and Brooks Robinson and installs them in our dugout I don't think we're going to the playoffs this year with Adam Jones or without him. Accepting that, this is the time to trade him and add to the group of prospects that will be coming out of the farm system in 2014.
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Re: Jair Jurrjens and Martin Prado

PostPost #22 by Tucker Blair » December 16th, 2011, 2:39 pm

This is what I wrote about Angle in my personal Blog near the end of the season:


I want to discuss the value of OF Matt Angle in the future. He has been getting substantial playing time in the latter part of the 2011 season.

Through 81 plate appearances, Matt Angle only has a wOBA of .268 . That is not exactly the kind of number you want from an Angle type of player. His biggest asset is clearly his speed. He essentially has minimal power (think of a lesser Brett Gardner). But the speed will not be efficiently used if he cannot find his way on base. Once he is one base though, he is practically a speed demon (10/11 SB so far in the MLB). I know that 81 plate appearances is a small number, but he will have to show a lot more in the next week or so to impress the organization. The biggest worry I have with Angle is that his wOBA has dropped each season, and every level up. While a standard drop is usually accurate, these drops are somewhat startling:

Year Class wOBA PA
2007 A- .402 287
2008 A .362 478
2009 A+ .345 478
2010 AA .410 70
2010 AAA .304 399
2011 AAA .328 489
2011 MLB .268 81

he ended up with 95 PA and a .287 wOBA, Which is a little better than when I originally posted this (September 22)
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Re: Jair Jurrjens and Martin Prado

PostPost #23 by birdwatcher55 » December 16th, 2011, 4:40 pm

ofahn wrote:
A_K wrote:I see nothing of substance to get excited about with Angle. But, I'm still fine with him getting extensive playing time this year to find out for sure.


Unless someone clones Babe Ruth, Cy Young,and Brooks Robinson and installs them in our dugout I don't think we're going to the playoffs this year with Adam Jones or without him. Accepting that, this is the time to trade him and add to the group of prospects that will be coming out of the farm system in 2014.

I understand your thinking and agree with it to a point but you have to bear in mind we have AJ under control for two more years. To move him now I would have to get a very enticing package and that is not something I see from the Braves. Perhaps somebody else steps up and if they do I would be all ears on this one, especially if someone offers three high end prospects 8-)
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Re: Jair Jurrjens and Martin Prado

PostPost #24 by ofahn » December 16th, 2011, 4:48 pm

birdwatcher55 wrote:To move him now I would have to get a very enticing package and that is not something I see from the Braves.


Think Washington Nationals and droll over their EXPENDABLE prospects.

http://www.baseballamerica.com/today/pr ... 12574.html
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Re: Jair Jurrjens and Martin Prado

PostPost #25 by DougDE » December 17th, 2011, 2:00 pm

A_K wrote:I see nothing of substance to get excited about with Angle. But, I'm still fine with him getting extensive playing time this year to find out for sure

I feel the same
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Re: Jair Jurrjens and Martin Prado

PostPost #26 by Matt P » December 18th, 2011, 3:03 am

TuckerBlair89 wrote:
Mike B wrote:I think Jurrjens is talented but I am not sure he would be much more productive then Guts in the AL East. As for Prado, I think he would be a good addition to the Orioles. Buck loves versatility and Prado provides that.


I wouldn't mind prado, but to give up talent for him would not benefit us. The Orioles have more than enough versatile people right now.
Angle can play all 3 OF positions
Andino can play all around the diamond
Reynolds, Reimold, Davis can play first (even Markakis LOL)
Antonelli can play 2nd and 3rd
Adams is there for 2B insurance
Flaherty is there as well and can play around too.

I am actually fine with the versatility of this club as of now.
Of course they could always upgrade, but I think they are better off seeing what Antonelli, Flaherty, Andino, Adams are capable of instead of going after Prado. He is 28 after all too.

Prado is better than Angle, Andino, Reynolds, Davis, Antonelli, Adams, and Flaherty.
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Re: Jair Jurrjens and Martin Prado

PostPost #27 by Tucker Blair » December 18th, 2011, 12:48 pm

Matt P wrote:
TuckerBlair89 wrote:
Mike B wrote:I think Jurrjens is talented but I am not sure he would be much more productive then Guts in the AL East. As for Prado, I think he would be a good addition to the Orioles. Buck loves versatility and Prado provides that.


I wouldn't mind prado, but to give up talent for him would not benefit us. The Orioles have more than enough versatile people right now.
Angle can play all 3 OF positions
Andino can play all around the diamond
Reynolds, Reimold, Davis can play first (even Markakis LOL)
Antonelli can play 2nd and 3rd
Adams is there for 2B insurance
Flaherty is there as well and can play around too.

I am actually fine with the versatility of this club as of now.
Of course they could always upgrade, but I think they are better off seeing what Antonelli, Flaherty, Andino, Adams are capable of instead of going after Prado. He is 28 after all too.

Prado is better than Angle, Andino, Reynolds, Davis, Antonelli, Adams, and Flaherty.
of course he is, but what does he do for the club besides give us maybe another win or two. He is a solid piece to bring in if you are a contending team. I like Prado but at the point the orioles are at, it does not make that much sense for us unless they make the appropriate moves along with it
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Re: Jair Jurrjens and Martin Prado

PostPost #28 by Tucker Blair » December 21st, 2011, 10:09 am

The Orioles reportedly decline a trade of Jones for Prado/Jurrjens and a pitching prospect.

I would like to know who the pitching prospect was, but I doubt we ever find out.
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Re: Jair Jurrjens and Martin Prado

PostPost #29 by Matt P » December 21st, 2011, 11:26 am

I would love to find out who the prospect was. Can't really have an opinion one way or the other unless we find out.
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Re: Jair Jurrjens and Martin Prado

PostPost #30 by birdwatcher55 » December 21st, 2011, 12:37 pm

Sub out Prado and drop in the Braves' top two pitching prospects, plus Jurrjens, and that would seem like a good deal for us 8-)
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