Old Sneakers wrote:I'm a huge believer in and fan of the draft. That 17th pick is going to hurt, but I do understand this is sometimes part of deal. I just do not want this being standard practice.
osforlife wrote:Hopefully, this eliminates the idiotic notion that Peter Angeles and the Orioles front office doesn't want to win.
Seafordeagles wrote:Although the Roberts signing came after arguably his best season with league highs in doubles, career highs in home runs, rbis, runs, and games played. He was pretty durable and not fragile until after he signed that contract in February 2010. At the time of his signing he was the best player on the Baltimore Orioles.
Seafordeagles wrote:Thanks for the feedback. I guess we should have traded Cal during the optimal time as well.
ofahn wrote:I'm a big critic of his ownership, but I still believe he wants to win. What I don't believe is that he has even a scintilla of a clue HOW to win.
In 1997 he had the best manager AND GM in baseball and chased them both away for reasons that can best be described as EGO. His hand picked replacement for Davey Johnson as manager took a team that was very similar to the 97 wins from the year before and turned it into 79 wins.
In 1999 his choice to replace Pat Gillick - Frank Wren - was denied the budget to hire the scouts or sign the players necessary to take advantage of a unique opportunity. In one of the worst performances in draft pick history the Orioles had seven of the first fifty picks and came away with just Brian Roberts while they passed on Alex Rios, Colby Lewis, Carl Crawford, Brandon Phillips, Ryan Doumit, John Lackey, and Justin Morneau in the first 90 picks among others in large part because of incomplete scouting reports and a lack of a budget to sign over-slot picks. Instead of learning a lesson about meddling and interfering in a process that, by this point, he should have known he knew nothing about, he instructed the FO to adjust their focus on "proven" players that performed like what they were - past their prime.
By the mid 2000s almost no one in baseball management with any real prospects wanted to work for him so he had a string of rookie managers that "blew him away" in interviews, but couldn't win with the over priced has beens, never were's, and other cast offs that were all that this team could attract. Keep in mind that there was virtually no real talent graduating from the farm system because Angelos wouldn't allow almost ANY investment in International talent, nor the farm system, nor building a proper player development system; AND he staffed the positions that over saw all of those processes with incompetent a@@ kissers. Syd Thrift, the GM he hired to replace Frank Wren (who has supervised some pretty decent drafts in Atlanta), complained that free agents acted like he was offering "Confederate money"; but the reality was players with other options didn't want to be part of an organization run the way ours was.
By mid 2007 Angelos' meddling had caused such a decline in attendance and MASN viewership that the team was no longer profitable so he brought in Andy MacPhail primarily to manage costs. AM sliced about 70M out of payroll over the next three seasons of which less than 10M went back into expanded player development despite the fact the team was little better than AAA quality and the farm system was barren.
AM actually made some quality trades that helped rebuild some value to the farm system, but Angelos insisted the team resign a fragile Brian Roberts instead of converting him into desperately needed prospects. The result was 40M wasted on a DL spot instead of being invested into rebuilding the farm system.
In 2010 Angelos insisted on Buck Showalter to replace Dave Trembley. He was right, and so is a broken clock twice a day.
In 2011 MacPhail was given instructions to add a fading Vladimir Guerrero in order to enhance fan interest at the cost of two farm teams and almost all of the International budget for that year.
In 2012 Angelos' reputation was so bad that the best GM candidates in the game wanted nothing to do with us so our FOURTH choice was Dan Duquette who hadn't held a ML position in ten years. This wasn't because Angelos had made a brilliant decision, we just got lucky. DD's contacts brought in some inexpensive quality players and the core of this team matured all at once. Combine that with an incredible string of luck and we ended a string of fourteen losing seasons and made the playoffs. Other than Buck as manager the 2012 season happened IN SPITE OF Angelos, not because of him.
This year Angelos authorized an additional 10M in payroll and DD has made the best of it. I hope for the sake of this franchise that this is a sign of ownership beginning to trust the people it has hired to run this team instead of meddling where he is clueless.
1. Do you have inside information in Baltimore's management or something? How do you know Frank Wren was denied the budget to hire scouts? How do you know the scouting reports were incomplete? How do you know the front office was instructed to go after aging free agents? Were you there when he said it? Maybe baseball operations wanted to add veteran talent. How do you know no money was being put into the player development system? Do you have the financial spreadsheets? How do you know Macphail was instructed to sign Guerrero?
2. I think you place way too much value on a manager. Managers don't run, field, hit, or pitch. They put the nine best players on the field, which a middle school'r could do, and sub in relief pitchers. Any person with a stat book can put in the pitchers with the best match-up. I wasn't alive during the 1998 season, but I highly doubt a single manager was worth 19 wins. Do you think maybe, just maybe, the team regressed because the pitching ERA went from 3.91 to 4.74?
3. It's easy to look at hindsight and say the Brian Roberts extension was a bad investment. At the time of the extension, Brian Roberts was stealing bases, walking, hitting .290, and playing good defense. Natural regression was expected, but he had he stayed healthy, he would have been worth his contract. You wouldn't believe Baltimore should have traded Roberts at that point if he stayed healthy.
Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 9 guests