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Santana, Jimenez, Morales, or none of the above?

Santana, Jimenez, Morales, or none of the above?

PostPost #1 by docjj » February 14th, 2014, 5:33 pm

Santana and Jimenez certainly come with some risk, and they are expensive. But I'm wondering if maybe we should sign one of them? Losing a draft pick hurts, but how often does the #17 pick become something useful? If you look back at the past 20 years, there were two super-successes: Cole Hammels, and Roy Halladay. But what about the other 20 guys? I don't think any of them even made the majors, let alone had an impact.

I certainly like Santana and Jimenez better than: Zach Britton (yuck), Steve Johnson, TJ McFarland, Brian Matusz, Suk Min Yoon or any of the other names being bantered about. Jimenez I've heard can be a head case, and Santana increased his ground ball rate dramatically and seemed to learn that offspeed stuff can be useful, so I'd prefer him. Tillman, Santana, Chen, Gonzales, Norris. (I think Norris will totally implode as a starter in the AL East and get relegated to the pen at some point, so hopefully one of the afformentioned guys might be ready to take over #5 by then).

I'd love to have Morales as DH, but probably not at the price to sign him plus loss of draft pick. I think we can make do with Reimold/Pearce/Urrutia at DH.
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Re: Santana, Jimenez, Morales, or none of the above?

PostPost #2 by Old Sneakers » February 14th, 2014, 6:16 pm

I wouldn't part with a draft choice for anyone except for a Justin Verlander type that is locked up for five years.
As for the DH, sure seems to me there is a good contact hitter out there in the minors that is blocked. I'd rather see a trade that raises few eyebrows and yields results. Neither will be happening between now and opening day this year.
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Re: Santana, Jimenez, Morales, or none of the above?

PostPost #3 by Seafordeagles » February 14th, 2014, 6:23 pm

Old Sneakers wrote:I wouldn't part with a draft choice for anyone except for a Justin Verlander type that is locked up for five years.
As for the DH, sure seems to me there is a good contact hitter out there in the minors that is blocked. I'd rather see a trade that raises few eyebrows and yields results. Neither will be happening between now and opening day this year.


They parted with a supplemental draft pick last year for Norris who will never resemble Justin Verlander. Not much difference between that pick and the #17 pick.
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Re: Santana, Jimenez, Morales, or none of the above?

PostPost #4 by Old Sneakers » February 14th, 2014, 6:36 pm

Not what I said though.

"I would not part with a draft choice for anyone but..."
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Re: Santana, Jimenez, Morales, or none of the above?

PostPost #5 by osforlife » February 14th, 2014, 9:28 pm

I have no expectations for anybody outside of the top five right now (Tillman, Chen, Gonzalez, Norris, Yoon).

Zach Britton- He's 26 with no options, no major league success, and a mediocre record of getting AAA hitters out. For Norfolk, Britton has a 3.98 ERA, 1.403 WHIP, and a 1.90 SO/BB. No wonder he doesn't succeed with the Orioles. He's hardly a AAA pitcher. His major league numbers are significantly worse in 46 starts. He doesn't deserve to make the team.

Steve Johnson- I like this guy, but he has an option remaining. He should start for Norfolk and provide solid depth. Hopefully he stays healthy. He'll see time in Baltimore this year, realistically as a reliever.

TJ McFarland- He was adequate as a reliever. I don't mind working him as a starter in the minors, but I don't think anything will come of it. He has a limited ceiling it appears. He'll see time in Baltimore this year, realistically as a reliever.

Brian Matusz- Matusz is a reliever. Period. He's out of options and hasn't succeeded as a starter since 2010. It's time to move on. He has found his future in the bullpen.

Tommy Hunter- See Matusz.

Alfredo Aceves- The man has enough trouble getting hitters out as a reliever. He has a horrible record in a limited sample as a starter. Stay in Norfolk's bullpen.

Josh Stinson- As a starter in the minors, he got hit hard, didn't throw enough strikes, and didn't strike out enough people. He is out of options and is strictly a reliever moving forward.

Liam Hendriks- He just turned 25, has a career minor league ERA under 3.00, has an option remaining, and has averaged 4.73 strikeouts to every walk in the minors. Steve Johnson and him often get overlooked I think, but they could end up providing the bigger impact over McFarland and company.

So there is Baltimore's "depth." It's obvious the Orioles need another pitcher after the top five. Ervin Santana or Ubaldo Jimenez would be welcome additions to the rotation. That being said, both of these pitchers are one year removed from an ERA over 5.00. Let's be careful for what we're paying for here. Chris Capuano represents a much more cost effective solution, that in all honesty, probably won't be much worse than these two guys at all. Signing them would also be very hypocritical after DD has said all off-season Baltimore will be a team that relies on the farm system. The minor leagues are just starting to turn into something decent again. Let's not ruin it.
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Re: Santana, Jimenez, Morales, or none of the above?

PostPost #6 by ofahn » February 17th, 2014, 11:46 am

Seafordeagles wrote:They parted with a supplemental draft pick last year for Norris who will never resemble Justin Verlander.

Hopefully, DD learned from his mistake.
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Re: Santana, Jimenez, Morales, or none of the above?

PostPost #7 by Old Sneakers » February 17th, 2014, 7:41 pm

The 17th pick is gone if this goes through. He would have to be very good indeed to warrant that loss of a draft choice. I am sitting here saying "OFFS!"
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Re: Santana, Jimenez, Morales, or none of the above?

PostPost #8 by ofahn » February 17th, 2014, 8:16 pm

Since our first pick is gone it makes more sense now to consider Morales on a TEAM FRIENDLY deal. I'm thinking about 8 to 10 million with another 5M in incentives and a vested option for 2015. Boras would have a s@@t fit but Morales is running out of time and options.

I would pass on Cruz at ANY price.
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Re: Santana, Jimenez, Morales, or none of the above?

PostPost #9 by DougDE » February 18th, 2014, 11:59 am

Now that the 1st rounder is gone, I would also like to see Morales signed. A 3 year for 35 to 40 mil contract sounds realistic to me. He's a solid major league hitter who's numbers should only go up moving from Seattle to Baltimore
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Re: Santana, Jimenez, Morales, or none of the above?

PostPost #10 by ofahn » February 18th, 2014, 12:43 pm

DougDE wrote:Now that the 1st rounder is gone, I would also like to see Morales signed. A 3 year for 35 to 40 mil contract sounds realistic to me. He's a solid major league hitter who's numbers should only go up moving from Seattle to Baltimore

I agree that Morales now becomes a more realistic option, but IMO you're suggesting more money than his market is (or he's worth) at this point. I don't remember where I saw it, but someone posted an analysis of what Morales would REALLY be worth and it was only about 1.5 WAR more than what we already had. I just don't see THAT being worth 12M a year for multiple years.

We HAD to overpay to get a #3 SP in Jimenez. We DON'T have to overpay to get hitters. Frankly, if Boras has to settle for a one year contract somewhere he would WANT to put Morales here because the park would allow him to have a big year.
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Re: Santana, Jimenez, Morales, or none of the above?

PostPost #11 by Rising O's » February 18th, 2014, 8:45 pm

Boras screwed up with Morales turning down the qualifier. Its not the first time he has given poor advice. I would offer 2 years and 18 million for Kendrys.
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