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Orioles MVP

Orioles MVP

PostPost #1 by osforlife » May 30th, 2013, 2:45 pm

Who has been the Orioles MVP two months through the season? No starting pitcher of the Orioles has been healthy and overwhelming the entire season to date. Obviously, a relief pitcher can not be an MVP even if he is having a fantastic year. So, with a honorable mention to Nick Markakis, I'd say the voting comes down to four noticeable candidates;
A.) Chris Davis; .359/.447/.766 with a league-leading 19 jacks!
B.) Manny Machado; .332/.365/.517 while playing excellent defense, stealing 5 bases, and producing a league-leading 77 hits & 24 doubles!
C.) Adam Jones; .313/.342/.522 with 8 steals and 10 home-runs, both good for second on the team.
D.) Nate McLouth; .293/.376/.431 with a league-leading 17 steals!

Chris Davis: baseball-reference WAR- 3.0, fangraphs WAR- 3.3
Manny Machado: baseball-reference WAR- 3.3, fangraphs WAR- 3.1
Adam Jones: baseball-reference WAR- 1.6, fangraphs WAR- 1.2
Nate McLouth: baseball-reference WAR- 1.2, fangraphs WAR- 1.2

Manny Machado was the only candidate to show a positive defense WAR, per baseball-reference.
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Re: Orioles MVP

PostPost #2 by birdwatcher55 » May 30th, 2013, 2:46 pm

Crush!!! Hands down 8-)
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Re: Orioles MVP

PostPost #3 by osforlife » May 30th, 2013, 2:59 pm

birdwatcher55 wrote:Crush!!! Hands down 8-)

I'd wouldn't say hands down. In fact, I don't even think I would pick him. But after examining the four justifications, I believe it is pretty easy to narrow the ballot down to two options.
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Re: Orioles MVP

PostPost #4 by A_K » May 30th, 2013, 3:50 pm

Per Fangraphs:

Chris Davis, second in baseball with 3.3 WAR.
Manny Machado, third in baseball with 3.1 WAR.

There's essentially no difference in .2 WAR. So, let's just summarize it as: Davis and Machado are easily two of the most valuable players in all of baseball right now.

Who's "most" valuable to this team? Flip a coin.
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Re: Orioles MVP

PostPost #5 by ofahn » May 30th, 2013, 6:08 pm

Do you think that Davis and Machado would be willing to share?
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Re: Orioles MVP

PostPost #6 by Old Sneakers » May 30th, 2013, 11:14 pm

Chris Davis, hands down.

The really cool thing here though, is that Manny Machado (healthy provided) will get better as time goes on. Immensely better if he moves over to SS and is outstanding!


*Honorable Mention*
Nate McLouth (Exceeded expectations so far. Apparently wants a fatter contract next year. He's earned it so far)
Adam Jones (Bonehead drops aside it's been a relatively fine year for Mr Jones)
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Re: Orioles MVP

PostPost #7 by birdwatcher55 » May 31st, 2013, 11:23 am

No love for Hammel?? He's 7-2 8-)
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Re: Orioles MVP

PostPost #8 by A_K » May 31st, 2013, 12:34 pm

birdwatcher55 wrote:No love for Hammel?? He's 7-2 8-)


He has a 5 ERA and a 1.5 WHIP. Not only has he not been our MVP, he hasn't even been very good at all.

His last two starts have been much better though so here's to hoping he's turned it around. But so far, he has had a bad season (and is a good example of why pitcher wins are meaningless).
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Re: Orioles MVP

PostPost #9 by ofahn » May 31st, 2013, 2:16 pm

A_K wrote:a good example of why pitcher wins are meaningless


How few TRULY understand that.
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Re: Orioles MVP

PostPost #10 by birdwatcher55 » May 31st, 2013, 2:38 pm

Where would we be without his 7-2 record?? Granted he is getting about 6.5 runs per game in support but he does keep you in contention with each start. Nobody else on the staff can seem to do that consistently. I'm not saying he's MVP but he's not far from it 8-)
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Re: Orioles MVP

PostPost #11 by osforlife » May 31st, 2013, 2:54 pm

birdwatcher55 wrote:Where would we be without his 7-2 record?? Granted he is getting about 6.5 runs per game in support but he does keep you in contention with each start. Nobody else on the staff can seem to do that consistently. I'm not saying he's MVP but he's not far from it 8-)

Why is it that Jason Hammel, who has pitched very poorly this season, gets praised for significant amount of runs his offense gives him? If his offense, a part of the game in which he has nothing to do with, gets less runs for him this year, Jason Hammel could be 2-7. Would he be getting "love" then?
Win-Loss record is a team measure, and you're using it to judge individuals. Pitchers cannot control the defense being played behind them and, in the AL, have absolutely nothing to do with their run support.

Consider that a pitcher for Team A could work 8 2/3 shutout innings before being removed with a 1-0 lead. A relief pitcher can allow a game-tying solo home run to Team B before recording one out. Then, Team A wins in the bottom of the ninth inning. The starting pitcher for Team A gets a no-decision while the reliever gets the win.

Not only that, but a pitcher could get a loss while allowing zero earned runs in a complete game, but a pitcher could also get a win after allowing eight earned runs in five innings.
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Re: Orioles MVP

PostPost #12 by LA Detective » May 31st, 2013, 3:12 pm

Forget Price, Contract and Age or past accomplishments. For 2013 where would you list these Orioles in all of MLB. Meaning who would you most want to be playing for a championship:

C- Posey is the best and is a winner. Mauer is great but has touble playing the full year. I know YMolina is a proven winner but I have to put Wieters 2nd. Maybe a bit bias but I think he can overtake YMolina. What he brings everyday behinnd the plate would make me take him over Mauer.

1b Votto then Davis.. Davis isn't just hot. He has escalated along the way to being at the level he is.

SS Hardy has to be in the top 3.. His D, top SS power and on-field leadership is why.

3b I know Cabrera has to be #1 and Longoria #2 and even David Wright in there, but what if Manny does't slow down or he improves as many think he will? I know Cabrera rakes but what about the D? If Manny stays at this level would Cabrera actually make us better?

OF Is there a better OF in baseball right now that combines offense and D?

Point is that we finally have some of the top players to compete like we saw the Yanks have for so long. Our everday lineup is suddenly championship caliber(tweak at 2b and DH and prove it in the playoffs).

But....our success will lie in the Pitching
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Re: Orioles MVP

PostPost #13 by mikezpen » May 31st, 2013, 9:55 pm

CHRIS DICKERSON!!!
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Re: Orioles MVP

PostPost #14 by dan72 » June 1st, 2013, 8:56 am

1. Davis
1a. Jones

If Jones did not have the miscues in the field I may have placed him above Davis. Both players are off to great starts with the bat.
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Re: Orioles MVP

PostPost #15 by ofahn » June 1st, 2013, 10:41 am

dan72 wrote:1. Davis
1a. Jones

If Jones did not have the miscues in the field I may have placed him above Davis. Both players are off to great starts with the bat.


Have you taken into consideration Machado's plus plus defense in your decision?
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