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Back to the Starting Rotation for 2013

Re: Back to the Starting Rotation for 2013

PostPost #31 by Rising O's » February 10th, 2013, 4:32 pm

Its hard to look at Matusz or Arrieta as starters given how awful they were last year. They were two anchors on the SS Playoff Bound in 2012. But I liked Matusz in his relief role better than I liked Arrieta's. He was more aggressive and showed better velocity, its something he can use to build his mental toughness on.
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Re: Back to the Starting Rotation for 2013

PostPost #32 by A_K » February 10th, 2013, 5:00 pm

Rising O's wrote:Its hard to look at Matusz or Arrieta as starters given how awful they were last year. They were two anchors on the SS Playoff Bound in 2012. But I liked Matusz in his relief role better than I liked Arrieta's. He was more aggressive and showed better velocity, its something he can use to build his mental toughness on.


Given their upside, pedigree and cost, both Matusz and Arrieta will get at least one more shot to prove they aren't starters. Tillman was left for dead at this time a year ago.

Matusz has established that he can be a dominant lefty reliever. That's a nice thing to have, but it'd still be a disaster to learn we used a top five draft pick on a loogy.

Arrieta put up good peripheral numbers last year but got very bad results. There's reason to believe those two numbers will move closer together going forward. If they do, he can be a useful starting pitcher.
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Re: Back to the Starting Rotation for 2013

PostPost #33 by ofahn » February 10th, 2013, 6:19 pm

A_K wrote:but it'd still be a disaster to learn we used a top five draft pick on a loogy


It looks like our top four pick in 2009 is heading for a career as a pizza delivery guy.
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Re: Back to the Starting Rotation for 2013

PostPost #34 by A_K » February 10th, 2013, 8:51 pm

Good point. Always worth keeping perspective. Still, Will Ohman had some good years as a loogy on a minor league contract without guaranteed money. Matusz was a big investment.
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Re: Back to the Starting Rotation for 2013

PostPost #35 by Old Sneakers » February 11th, 2013, 2:02 pm

Rising O's wrote:Its hard to look at Matusz or Arrieta as starters given how awful they were last year. They were two anchors on the SS Playoff Bound in 2012. But I liked Matusz in his relief role better than I liked Arrieta's. He was more aggressive and showed better velocity, its something he can use to build his mental toughness on.


Really want both of these guys starting. In Baltimore or a fresh start elsewhere. These two were supposed to be the anchors of the rotation. I won't make excuses for Arrieta, but he looked pretty solid early on. Only to have the wheels fall off. I keep hoping that the elbow surgery he had at the end of 2011 was the reason and he bounces back strong.
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Re: Back to the Starting Rotation for 2013

PostPost #36 by ofahn » February 11th, 2013, 9:24 pm

Old Sneakers wrote:he looked pretty solid early on. Only to have the wheels fall off. I keep hoping that the elbow surgery he had at the end of 2011 was the reason and he bounces back strong.


It's not his arm, it's his self confidence issues.
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Re: Back to the Starting Rotation for 2013

PostPost #37 by Old Sneakers » February 12th, 2013, 9:37 am

Since pitchers and catchers report today, I thought I would make a list of concerns.

1-Tillman isn't up to par. Now out of options. What happens?
2-Hammel, Chen and Gonzalez have an assortment of command or health issues.
3-Matusz and Arrieta are forced into the rotation because other arms aren't healthy.
4-Britton loses his ability to get ground balls.


Technically there are I believe eight guys competing for five rotation spots (Hammel, Chen, Tillman, Gonzalez, Britton, Arrieta, Matusz and Johnson). As we all know a great number of things can and will go wrong throughout the season. What seems most important early on is consistency early. Or, avoiding a rash of issues all at once. Last season they had a ton of different guys make starts. Hopefully the need is not quite so great this season.

I'm hoping that if Arrieta and Matusz don't make the rotation and get to start the season in Norfolk and regain some status as starting pitchers. I frankly do not want to see them in the pen again. I would have Zach Britton be our #5 guy. He isn't flashy but a ground ball machine is valuable. It need not be flashy, just competitive. Though I should say I wouldn't count Steve Johnson out. He's a hard worker and done pretty well at everything that has been asked of him.

I suspect the sluggish or unappealing trade offers the team fielded last winter get a tad better as the trade deadline approaches. With Dylan Bundy and Kevin Gausmann to consider in the near and not so near future the team likely will consider a move. The original cavalry of Tillman, Arrieta and Matusz are appearing more likely to become targets. If Bundy really is close to being ready for the rotation near the end of the season then it's possible two get moved. If not, we can wait.
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Re: Back to the Starting Rotation for 2013

PostPost #38 by osforlife » February 12th, 2013, 3:43 pm

I've been reading on Roch's blog; he has been saying that Hunter has a chance to make the rotation; No, just no. He has no chance of making the rotation or becoming a quality starter. He is a now a relief pitcher, has a spot locked up for him, and should be very effective in one inning stints.

I'd automatically send Zach Britton, Brian Matusz, and Jake Arrieta to the minors. IMO, they need to prove they can effectively START in the minors before receiving any role with the Orioles. I'd to fine with having them spend the whole year starting in the minors, but they will almost certainly have bullpen spots by September. We have them all under control for at least four more years, so one year in the minors, finishing off their development, while providing minimal production at the big league level isn't a terrible thing.

This means the 5th starter spot is basically up to Todd Redmond and Steve Johnson. Neither of them would perform very well as a starter in the majors, but they could hold their own till Wada or Jurrjens gets healthy. I wouldn't seriously consider T.J. McFarland as a starter. He consistently gave up over 9 hits per 9 innings and less than 7 strikeouts per 9 innings in the minors. He has a fair chance of making the team as a 7th bullpen pitcher.

Also, why is Chris Tillman not lumped together with the three locks in the rotation(Chen, Hammel, Gonzalez). I've seen it here and on Roch's blog. The man pitched outta of his mind for half a season, and he has no options. I could care less if he puts up a 7.00 ERA in ST. He will be in our rotation next year. Unless he is hurt and cannot pitch in early April, he will be in the Baltimore Orioles rotation.
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Re: Back to the Starting Rotation for 2013

PostPost #39 by Seafordeagles » February 12th, 2013, 5:25 pm

I'm going to go out on a limb and say McFarland has no chance to make this roster.
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Re: Back to the Starting Rotation for 2013

PostPost #40 by osforlife » February 12th, 2013, 6:47 pm

Seafordeagles wrote:I'm going to go out on a limb and say McFarland has no chance to make this roster.

He is a Rule V. He definitely has a chance. Is a Rotation of Hammel, Chen, Tillman, Gonzalez, Johnson & Bullpen of Johnson, O'Day, Patton, Hunter, Ayala, Strop, McFarland not realistic? And that is without injuries.
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Re: Back to the Starting Rotation for 2013

PostPost #41 by ofahn » February 12th, 2013, 6:57 pm

Seafordeagles wrote:I'm going to go out on a limb and say McFarland has no chance to make this roster.


What do you base that on?
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Re: Back to the Starting Rotation for 2013

PostPost #42 by Seafordeagles » February 12th, 2013, 8:46 pm

ofahn wrote:
What do you base that on?


That in 5 minor league seasons he has not made the major leagues for a team that has really been hurting for pitching and wasn't protected by Cleveland. I have a hard time believing that he can pitch as good as Britton or Matusz, who put up much better numbers in the minor leagues.
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Re: Back to the Starting Rotation for 2013

PostPost #43 by Seafordeagles » February 12th, 2013, 8:53 pm

osforlife wrote:He is a Rule V. He definitely has a chance. Is a Rotation of Hammel, Chen, Tillman, Gonzalez, Johnson & Bullpen of Johnson, O'Day, Patton, Hunter, Ayala, Strop, McFarland not realistic? And that is without injuries.


Can you tell me what percentage of rule V players actually stick with their new teams? It's pretty low. Could he be a major find, sure. Would I like to be wrong, certainly.

Why I don't think he will make the team is that there are 2 other lefties fighting for spots. Another reason is he was 12th player taken in the draft and was passed over by a lot of teams because the Orioles drafted 23rd.
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Re: Back to the Starting Rotation for 2013

PostPost #44 by A_K » February 12th, 2013, 9:40 pm

Seafordeagles wrote:
Can you tell me what percentage of rule V players actually stick with their new teams? It's pretty low. Could he be a major find, sure. Would I like to be wrong, certainly.

Why I don't think he will make the team is that there are 2 other lefties fighting for spots. Another reason is he was 12th player taken in the draft and was passed over by a lot of teams because the Orioles drafted 23rd.


I believe the number I've heard is that 70 percent of Rule 5 picks are returned to their previous team.
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Re: Back to the Starting Rotation for 2013

PostPost #45 by osforlife » February 13th, 2013, 3:11 pm

Seafordeagles wrote:
Can you tell me what percentage of rule V players actually stick with their new teams? It's pretty low. Could he be a major find, sure. Would I like to be wrong, certainly.

Why I don't think he will make the team is that there are 2 other lefties fighting for spots. Another reason is he was 12th player taken in the draft and was passed over by a lot of teams because the Orioles drafted 23rd.

So is that pitching roster not realistic? I sure think it is, and that is without injuries.
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