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"O's still in talks with Joe Saunders" & "want to add a starter"

Re: "O's still in talks with Joe Saunders" & "want to add a starter"

PostPost #16 by birdwatcher55 » December 29th, 2012, 5:44 pm

Look like we're one of four teams in the hunt from what I have read 8-)
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Re: "O's still in talks with Joe Saunders" & "want to add a starter"

PostPost #17 by BaltimoreSportsNut » December 31st, 2012, 2:50 pm

Here is the bottom line, honestly whoever is the #5 starter out of spring training, shouldn't be our number #5 starter by mid-june that distinction should hopefully go to Dylan Bundy, and heck who knows come August or September Gausman could be in there as well. The great part of having Saunders is that he could eat some innings and save the bullpen, but if Matusz isn't in the bullpen he better be in AAA. He has had enough opportunities in the starting rotation, and when he was moved to the bullpen last year, he was fantastic, just a different mentality out there and he seemed to thrive in that role.
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Re: "O's still in talks with Joe Saunders" & "want to add a starter"

PostPost #18 by osforlife » December 31st, 2012, 3:18 pm

Here are where I think the rotation candidates should be/will be by 2013 Opening Day:
Jason Hammel, Wei Yen Chen, Chris Tillman, Miguel Gonzalez- MLB Rotation
Tommy Hunter, Steve Johnson- MLB Bullpen
Brian Matusz, Zach Britton, Jake Arrieta- AAA Rotation
Dylan Bundy, Kevin Gausman- AA Rotation
Tsuyoshi Wada- Extended Spring Training(if ready, MLB Bullpen)
That would leave us with one spot to fill in the rotation for someone like Saunders. If any of the non MLB Rotation pitchers are forcing a move into the MLB Rotation, Saunders and/or Hammel could become expendable.
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Re: "O's still in talks with Joe Saunders" & "want to add a starter"

PostPost #19 by ofahn » December 31st, 2012, 5:15 pm

osforlife wrote:Dylan Bundy, Kevin Gausman- AA Rotation


I could see Bundy starting in AAA. He just needs to put the finishing touches on his complimentary pitches to be ready for the majors.

BaltimoreSportsNut wrote:shouldn't be our number #5 starter by mid-june that distinction should hopefully go to Dylan Bundy


What I see as Bundy's biggest obstacle to become a full time member of the Orioles' staff is the innings limit the team will put on him this year. He threw 105.1 innings last year and the team will almost certainly not allow him to exceed 150 this year. If you assume he'll need about a third of those in AAA to finish off his curve ball and change up he'd have about 100 innings left for Baltimore.

Do you let him pitch until he hits his limit? If so, we'll have our own Strasburg controversy next year and a potential big hole in the rotation in September and October. Do you try to delay his return to Baltimore so he can pitch till the 162nd game? If so, you still wouldn't have any innings left for the post season.

I honestly think the best course for Dylan Bundy is let him get his work in at AAA and ONLY bring him up on an emergency basis. If he pitches about 50 ML innings spread out over about eight starts he'll get enough experience to be ready for 2014 when he should be cleared to pitch a full season.

Let's face it; if we NEED Dylan Bundy as a SP in 2013 then a whole LOT of things have gone wrong.
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Re: "O's still in talks with Joe Saunders" & "want to add a starter"

PostPost #20 by LA Detective » December 31st, 2012, 5:43 pm

I would like to see Bundy start out very similar to last year.
1. He is still very young and building a base can only help him.
2. He should be better later in the year than the beginning. This should keep him fresh and we get the finished product for the 2nd half.
I would have him a little ahead of last yers pace going into late July and then he would be available to finish the year as a regular starter.

I know there are some thoughts he might get bored at last years pace but thats where good leadership convinces him to be more concerned how his Change up is getting over or other things he's working on instead of just how many hitters he has blown away.

IF and I mean IF Bundy takes a big leap this year and is fully ready, then I dont think it means alot has gone bad. It would be like trading for a very good starter at the deadline.

If we dont get a starter this winter, it will be a very interesting ST. I wouldn't be suprised to see a great battle for the 5th spot from Matusz,Arrieta, Britton and even SJohnson.

To me adding Saunders isnt a must, its more of a depth thing. But if DD/Buck are going to trade someone or if they plan on spoting a 6th starter during some long consecutive game streaks then his need would be more.
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Re: "O's still in talks with Joe Saunders" & "want to add a starter"

PostPost #21 by ofahn » December 31st, 2012, 6:17 pm

LA Detective wrote:IF and I mean IF Bundy takes a big leap this year and is fully ready, then I dont think it means alot has gone bad.


You might have misunderstood me. I was pointing out that if we NEED Bundy in the starting rotation then a LOT has gone wrong. It would mean that the others in front of him Saunders(?), Matusz, Britton, and Arrieta have all either failed or been injured. That wouldn't be good.
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Re: "O's still in talks with Joe Saunders" & "want to add a starter"

PostPost #22 by LA Detective » December 31st, 2012, 7:56 pm

Got it...thats true ...here's to that situation not happening. I hope the only way he is up is if he is nearly ready to dominate.
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Re: "O's still in talks with Joe Saunders" & "want to add a starter"

PostPost #23 by mikezpen » December 31st, 2012, 11:12 pm

I'd like them to sign Saunders because it gives them five pretty solid starters. This enables the trade of one-most likely Tillman-for hitting if the right deal comes along.Absent a trade, having Saunders w/b good insurance in case injury or the dreaded sophomore jinx levels one or more in the rotation.

If we don't get Saunders and still decide to trade-say Tillman-then you're down to three starters, one of whom is Hammell who is a free agent next yr.You are then losing time and games scratching around trying to fill two spots in the rotation, something you don't want to be doing if you plan on contending.As was said earlier, if Bundy (or Gausman for that matter) must be brought up here this year, a lot has gone wrong.
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Re: "O's still in talks with Joe Saunders" & "want to add a starter"

PostPost #24 by OriolesRedskins28 » January 5th, 2013, 2:52 pm

According to Rock Kubatko Saunders is seeking a 4 year deal and will probably hold firm and refuse to go lower than 3 years. If that's the case then I would move on if I were the Orioles. He's a back of the rotation starter at best and while SP depth is always nice, the Orioles have plenty of options for the back of the rotation.

I've said it before, I want the Orioles to take a similar approach to Bundy (and Gausman) this year as they did last year with him. Start him off slow so he will still be pitching late in the year. Maybe not quite as slow as they did last year when he was limited to 3 innings for almost half of his season, but still keep it slow enough that he'll be able to pitch into September.
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Re: "O's still in talks with Joe Saunders" & "want to add a starter"

PostPost #25 by Jordan Tuwiner » January 5th, 2013, 2:57 pm

OriolesRedskins28 wrote:According to Rock Kubatko Saunders is seeking a 4 year deal and will probably hold firm and refuse to go lower than 3 years. If that's the case then I would move on if I were the Orioles. He's a back of the rotation starter at best and while SP depth is always nice, the Orioles have plenty of options for the back of the rotation.

I've said it before, I want the Orioles to take a similar approach to Bundy (and Gausman) this year as they did last year with him. Start him off slow so he will still be pitching late in the year. Maybe not quite as slow as they did last year when he was limited to 3 innings for almost half of his season, but still keep it slow enough that he'll be able to pitch into September.

I agree, but also think a three year deal could work depending on the $ thrown his way. If Saunders is willing to pitch as a reliever in the last two years of the deal I think the O's would be much more willing to work something out. Then again, the O's already have a bunch of relievers.
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Re: "O's still in talks with Joe Saunders" & "want to add a starter"

PostPost #26 by ofahn » January 5th, 2013, 4:59 pm

Jordan Tuwiner wrote:I agree, but also think a three year deal could work depending on the $ thrown his way. If Saunders is willing to pitch as a reliever in the last two years of the deal I think the O's would be much more willing to work something out. Then again, the O's already have a bunch of relievers.


My guess is that he's looking for at least what he made last year (6M) times three. I could see a small bump for one year but I wouldn't want to pay 5M+ a year for a reliever that's not a closer. Especially, not for two years.
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Re: "O's still in talks with Joe Saunders" & "want to add a starter"

PostPost #27 by A_K » January 5th, 2013, 5:36 pm

Good god no.
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Re: "O's still in talks with Joe Saunders" & "want to add a starter"

PostPost #28 by osforlife » January 5th, 2013, 5:49 pm

If Saunders is looking for three years, go after Marcum. I doubt he will get more than two years, he had a back problem this year and only made 21 starts. Plus, Marcum is a much better pitcher.
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Re: "O's still in talks with Joe Saunders" & "want to add a starter"

PostPost #29 by ofahn » January 5th, 2013, 7:15 pm

osforlife wrote:If Saunders is looking for three years, go after Marcum.


I would agree that Marcum for ONE year is a better choice than Saunders for three, but I still wouldn't want to sign a #4 or #5 SP for more than one year.
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Re: "O's still in talks with Joe Saunders" & "want to add a starter"

PostPost #30 by osforlife » January 5th, 2013, 7:22 pm

ofahn wrote:
I would agree that Marcum for ONE year is a better choice than Saunders for three, but I still wouldn't want to sign a #4 or #5 SP for more than one year.

There isn't any doubt in my mind Shaun Marcum is better than a #4/#5 starting pitcher. I would be willing to go two years on Marcum. If we can get him for one, great. If not, that's okay too.
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