Welcome to the Orioles Nation Forums! Like most online communities, you must register to post on our message board. However, posting is free--it always will be--and registration is a simple process. Become part of the growing Orioles Nation community and register now!

Could Manny Machado be the O's solution at 3b??

Re: Could Manny Machado be the O's solution at 3b??

PostPost #16 by ofahn » August 30th, 2012, 4:01 pm

A_K wrote:I'd be fine with them going out and getting a left fielder, but I also think with Reimold, Hoes and Avery we have enough depth and upside at the position to justify leaving it as is.


I could see the team making an offer to McLouth to stay on in Chavez's role next season.
User avatar
ofahn
Aberdeen IronBirds
 
Posts: 4402
Joined: May 2011
Reputation Score: 85

Re: Could Manny Machado be the O's solution at 3b??

PostPost #17 by ofahn » August 30th, 2012, 4:02 pm

A_K wrote:Shaun Marcum and Edwin Jackson interest me on the hill


I would hope they would ONLY consider them on one year deals.
User avatar
ofahn
Aberdeen IronBirds
 
Posts: 4402
Joined: May 2011
Reputation Score: 85

Re: Could Manny Machado be the O's solution at 3b??

PostPost #18 by osforlife » August 30th, 2012, 4:44 pm

ofahn wrote:
I would hope they would ONLY consider them on one year deals.

Could I ask why? Because Marcum is 30 and Jackson is 28. I don't think they'll be looking for one year deals.
User avatar
osforlife
Aberdeen IronBirds
 
Posts: 1628
Joined: October 2011
Location: Southern Maryland
Reputation Score: 59

Re: Could Manny Machado be the O's solution at 3b??

PostPost #19 by A_K » August 30th, 2012, 6:32 pm

I picked Jackson and Marcum because I don't expect either will get huge contracts, and I think they're both generally better than they're given credit for. Everything comes down to numbers, and if either player's price gets bid up DD should be more than happy to walk away from the negotiating table, but the Gonzalez/Hammel/Chen successes are a good example that you don't need to invest hugely to find productive starters.
A_K
GCL Orioles
 
Posts: 608
Joined: April 2011
Reputation Score: 43

Re: Could Manny Machado be the O's solution at 3b??

PostPost #20 by osforlife » August 30th, 2012, 8:02 pm

A_K wrote:I picked Jackson and Marcum because I don't expect either will get huge contracts, and I think they're both generally better than they're given credit for. Everything comes down to numbers, and if either player's price gets bid up DD should be more than happy to walk away from the negotiating table, but the Gonzalez/Hammel/Chen successes are a good example that you don't need to invest hugely to find productive starters.

I'd say they are both #3 starters. marcum possibly #2. I think Gonzalez, Hammel, Chen, and Tillman have spots going into next year though.Then theres Wada. I think DD we'll really just being adding alot of depth this offseason again.
User avatar
osforlife
Aberdeen IronBirds
 
Posts: 1628
Joined: October 2011
Location: Southern Maryland
Reputation Score: 59

Re: Could Manny Machado be the O's solution at 3b??

PostPost #21 by ofahn » August 30th, 2012, 8:26 pm

osforlife wrote:Could I ask why? Because Marcum is 30 and Jackson is 28. I don't think they'll be looking for one year deals.


Marcum is a fly ball pitcher that has some health issues (back?) this year and will be 31 next spring. To me that's between a small one year contract and PASS. Jackson is...well...Jackson. There's a reason that 29 teams passed on the "opportunity" to give him the contract he wanted last year and he was forced to take a one year deal. In order to limit their exposure to just one year again the Nats may offer him arbitration this winter. If they do it would cost us our first round pick to sign him. PASS. Besides, DD got us THREE years of Chen for what the Nats paid for ONE year of Jackson, and I consider Chen a better pitcher.

There will be a TON of free agent SPs this winter. It's almost a buyers' market so we should be able to pick up two at a fair price without more that a one year commitment.

Check this link http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2011/04/2 ... gents.html
User avatar
ofahn
Aberdeen IronBirds
 
Posts: 4402
Joined: May 2011
Reputation Score: 85

Re: Could Manny Machado be the O's solution at 3b??

PostPost #22 by Matt P » August 31st, 2012, 1:58 am

Edwin Jackson would be the 2nd or 3rd best pitcher on the O's.
Matt P
Aberdeen IronBirds
 
Posts: 1717
Joined: October 2011
Location: Pennsylvania
Reputation Score: 37

Re: Could Manny Machado be the O's solution at 3b??

PostPost #23 by Jordan Tuwiner » August 31st, 2012, 9:32 am

Matt P wrote:Edwin Jackson would be the 2nd or 3rd best pitcher on the O's. ofahn has it out for him for some reason and never offers any reason why. He even once said he'd rather Michael Jackson pitch for the O's than Edwin and when asked why he just ignored the question. He'll just say something along the lines of "he's Edwin Jackson" or "nobody else wants him". Just reading his quotes in your posts reminds me why I blocked him.

Actually, if you had not blocked him you would have been able to see his defense and why he is opposed to Jackson. If you check the rules of the board, you will see that flaming or attacking other posters is not allowed. Please no more of this and try to limit your responses to strictly discussion.
User avatar
Jordan Tuwiner
Aberdeen IronBirds
 
Posts: 2588
Joined: September 2010
Location: Israel
Reputation Score: 57



Re: Could Manny Machado be the O's solution at 3b??

PostPost #24 by A_K » August 31st, 2012, 11:21 am

Edwin Jackson is closing in on his fourth consecutive season posting an fWAR above 3. Let's assume he falls a bit short and finishes at 2.8 fWAR (at 2.2 right now). That would bring his four-year average to 3.5 fWAR, worth roughly $17.5 million per season. This year he earned $11 million (meaning the next bit of positive value he provides this year will give the Nationals surplus value on their one-year commitment). Last year he earned $8.75 million, splitting $10.25 million of surplus value between two teams. A year earlier he was paid $4.6 million, splitting surplus value of $14.4 million between two teams. A year earlier the Tigers paid him $2.2 million, giving them $15.8 million in surplus value.

Edwin Jackson's performance speaks for itself. He's an under-appreciated asset in this league.
A_K
GCL Orioles
 
Posts: 608
Joined: April 2011
Reputation Score: 43

Re: Could Manny Machado be the O's solution at 3b??

PostPost #25 by Oriole85 » August 31st, 2012, 2:17 pm

A_K wrote:
I'd be fine with them going out and getting a left fielder, but I also think with Reimold, Hoes and Avery we have enough depth and upside at the position to justify leaving it as is.

I'd love to see them sign Swisher or Konerko at first. Shaun Marcum and Edwin Jackson interest me on the hill.

I'm not sure if Hoes&Avery are anything more than 4th OFers. And I would be *fine* with Reimold IF he could stay healthy.
Oriole85
DSL Orioles
 
Posts: 67
Joined: October 2011
Reputation Score: 3

Re: Could Manny Machado be the O's solution at 3b??

PostPost #26 by Oriole85 » August 31st, 2012, 2:19 pm

osforlife wrote:Could I ask why? Because Marcum is 30 and Jackson is 28. I don't think they'll be looking for one year deals.

Only way they are getting one-way deals is if we give them good money like E-Jax got this year. But with him, he'll be strongly looking for a multi-year deal I'm guessing since he's on a one-year deal this year.
Oriole85
DSL Orioles
 
Posts: 67
Joined: October 2011
Reputation Score: 3

Re: Could Manny Machado be the O's solution at 3b??

PostPost #27 by Oriole85 » August 31st, 2012, 2:20 pm

A_K wrote:I picked Jackson and Marcum because I don't expect either will get huge contracts, and I think they're both generally better than they're given credit for. Everything comes down to numbers, and if either player's price gets bid up DD should be more than happy to walk away from the negotiating table, but the Gonzalez/Hammel/Chen successes are a good example that you don't need to invest hugely to find productive starters.

That's my philosophy more with relief pitchers. I think we got much better than expected production from all three of them. I believe this would be tough too duplicate. I'd rather spending on starting pitching than just about anything else right now.
Oriole85
DSL Orioles
 
Posts: 67
Joined: October 2011
Reputation Score: 3

Re: Could Manny Machado be the O's solution at 3b??

PostPost #28 by ofahn » August 31st, 2012, 2:50 pm

A_K wrote:Edwin Jackson's performance speaks for itself. He's an under-appreciated asset in this league.


His value this winter will hinge on how he pitches in the playoffs. He hasn't a lot of success there.

I can see the Nats making him a qualifying offer so that they either get him back on a one year contract with a modest raise or they get a draft pick. I just don't want that pick to be ours.
User avatar
ofahn
Aberdeen IronBirds
 
Posts: 4402
Joined: May 2011
Reputation Score: 85

Re: Could Manny Machado be the O's solution at 3b??

PostPost #29 by osforlife » August 31st, 2012, 2:51 pm

ofahn wrote:
Marcum is a fly ball pitcher that has some health issues (back?) this year and will be 31 next spring. To me that's between a small one year contract and PASS. Jackson is...well...Jackson. There's a reason that 29 teams passed on the "opportunity" to give him the contract he wanted last year and he was forced to take a one year deal. In order to limit their exposure to just one year again the Nats may offer him arbitration this winter. If they do it would cost us our first round pick to sign him. PASS. Besides, DD got us THREE years of Chen for what the Nats paid for ONE year of Jackson, and I consider Chen a better pitcher.

There will be a TON of free agent SPs this winter. It's almost a buyers' market so we should be able to pick up two at a fair price without more that a one year commitment.

Check this link http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2011/04/2 ... gents.html

Comparing Chen and Jackson's contracts here are invalid. The argument is why the Orioles would only give Marcum and Jackson one year deals. Both are in their prime and have pitched well the past three years. Look at their FIP's more 2010, 2011, and 2012. They hardly flunctuate. Nobody wanted to give Jackson a 5 year deal. Thats why he didn't get his desired contract. Saying Marcum is a flyball pitcher is un-important too. He would be a flyball pitcher for the one year on a single season contract and he would be a flyball pitcher for x # of years of his multi year contract.
User avatar
osforlife
Aberdeen IronBirds
 
Posts: 1628
Joined: October 2011
Location: Southern Maryland
Reputation Score: 59

Re: Could Manny Machado be the O's solution at 3b??

PostPost #30 by ofahn » August 31st, 2012, 3:05 pm

osforlife wrote:Comparing Chen and Jackson's contracts here are invalid. The argument is why the Orioles would only give Marcum and Jackson one year deals. Both are in their prime and have pitched well the past three years. Look at their FIP's more 2010, 2011, and 2012. They hardly flunctuate. Nobody wanted to give Jackson a 5 year deal. Thats why he didn't get his desired contract. Saying Marcum is a flyball pitcher is un-important too. He would be a flyball pitcher for the one year on a single season contract and he would be a flyball pitcher for x # of years of his multi year contract.


Players generally perform at their highest level when they are playing for their next contract. First, why take that incentive away from them? Second, this winter will be basically a buyers' market. We will have a TON of SPs to choose from. Our money will go a long way. Third, we don't yet know whether we NEED to add long term SP assets. We have Chen for two years and an option. If Hammel pitches as well next year as he did this year he will certainly be offered arbitration, if not an extension. Tillman, Britton, Arrieta, and Matusz are all controllable for at least three years. Are they established? No, but frankly they haven't been developed properly until this year. We will probably see Dylan Bundy and Michael Wright start games in Baltimore next season and they may, along with Bobby Bundy, become important parts of our pitching staff in 2014. Steve Johnson and Miguel Gonzales have shown they deserve consideration; and Wada may contribute in 2013, too.

That's a long winded way of saying we MAY need some pitching depth next year, but why sign an expensive pitcher for more than one season if WE DON'T NEED HIM BEYOND 2013?
User avatar
ofahn
Aberdeen IronBirds
 
Posts: 4402
Joined: May 2011
Reputation Score: 85


PreviousNext

Return to Baltimore Orioles

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Seafordeagles and 7 guests

cron