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Orioles Looking For Catcher, Could Deal Troy Patton

Orioles Looking For Catcher, Could Deal Troy Patton

PostPost #1 by osforlife » May 11th, 2014, 4:13 pm

The Orioles are trying hard to find a backup catcher, FOX Sports’ Ken Rosenthal tweets. Matt Wieters currently has an elbow injury that limits him to DH duty, leaving the Orioles with Steve Clevenger and Caleb Joseph behind the dish. Joseph, a minor-league veteran, had been hitting just .261/.284/.402 at Triple-A Norfolk, although he hit .299/.346/.494 for Double-A Bowie in 2013.

The O’s are considering offers for pitcher Troy Patton, USA Today’s Bob Nightengale tweets, connecting that information to their backup catcher search. Patton has made three appearances out of the Orioles’ bullpen this season after serving a 25-game suspension for a positive amphetamine test. He posted a 3.70 ERA with 6.8 K/9 and 2.6 BB/9 for the Orioles in 2013.


http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2014/05/o ... qus_thread

I don't really understand this. Wieters just hit the DL today, but the catching depth in this organization is fine. Clevenger is the best back-up catcher that you're going to find. Him and Caleb Joseph could form a platoon until Wieters comes back. The last thing I want is a Taylor Teagarden, Chris Snyder, or Ronny Paulino coming into the organization.
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Re: Orioles Looking For Catcher, Could Deal Troy Patton

PostPost #2 by Seafordeagles » May 11th, 2014, 5:03 pm

If it's true then it's pretty obvious they are not enamored with Joseph. Unless Rosenthal completely pulled this out of thin air. Writers do this all the time. Just last week it was reported we were going to sign Morales. Duquette squashed that rumor real fast and even said there hadn't been any dialogue in months regarding Morales.

These writers keep coming up with unsubstantiated rumors when they should try to just report on the games.
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Re: Orioles Looking For Catcher, Could Deal Troy Patton

PostPost #3 by mikezpen » May 12th, 2014, 2:23 am

Agree w/osforlife.The last thing the Orioles need is another catch-and-throw type who can't hit a lick. And if they truly want one, they don't need to trade Patton to get him.

They s/b looking for a minor league arm that can be converted to a late-inning reliever or closer. There's little or nothing promising in their system.
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Re: Orioles Looking For Catcher, Could Deal Troy Patton

PostPost #4 by ofahn » May 12th, 2014, 1:37 pm

osforlife wrote:catching depth in this organization is fine

It is, but the real talent is at the lower level.

Apparently, the FO believes this is a playoff caliber team and they don't want to wait to find out if they have enough ML ready catching IF Wieters is out for a long period of time. I have also expected them to shop Patton because I think he has worn out his welcome here. IMO Patton and someone like Chance Sisco for Max Stassi makes a lot of sense. Both teams got solid value where they need it right now.

http://www.baseball-reference.com/minor ... assi001max
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Re: Orioles Looking For Catcher, Could Deal Troy Patton

PostPost #5 by ofahn » May 12th, 2014, 1:40 pm

Seafordeagles wrote:it's pretty obvious they are not enamored with Joseph

... and with good reason. Joseph has worked hard to be good enough to get called up, BUT he still has limited skills in the catch and throw areas. In my opinion Brian Ward is the best defensive C in our upper minors, but I could see why the FO has doubts whether he can hit in the ML.
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Re: Orioles Looking For Catcher, Could Deal Troy Patton

PostPost #6 by Seafordeagles » May 12th, 2014, 3:52 pm

ofahn wrote:IMO Patton and someone like Chance Sisco for Max Stassi makes a lot of sense. Both teams got solid value where they need it right now.


I disagree completely on moving your 2nd round pick this soon. I thought you were the guy that wants to build the farm system. He's only 19 years old. It's much too soon to deal him.
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Re: Orioles Looking For Catcher, Could Deal Troy Patton

PostPost #7 by osforlife » May 12th, 2014, 4:38 pm

That proposed trade for Stassi is just unnecessary at this point. While I see the appeal of obtaining a young, almost major league catcher, the catching depth in the organization is the least of Baltimore's worries. A starting catcher is something the O's will worry about in a couple off-seasons. For now, we'll see how the catchers in the organization progress. Can Brian Ward hit AAA pitching? Is Ohlman the real deal? How are the young catchers doing? Is Monell worth keeping? Can Joseph stick at catcher? These are the questions Baltimore's FO should be asking; not "what young catcher should we trade for?" BTW, I'm in favor of trading Matusz over Patton.
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Re: Orioles Looking For Catcher, Could Deal Troy Patton

PostPost #8 by ofahn » May 19th, 2014, 12:26 pm

Seafordeagles wrote:I thought you were the guy that wants to build the farm system. He's only 19 years old. It's much too soon to deal him.

That's exactly what I want to do; however, I am suggesting an out of the box method.

Right now the highest level legitimate C prospect in our system is Michael Ohlman. There's some legitimate concern whether his glove will allow him to be an average or better ML C AND he has struggled with his first prolonged exposure to AA pitching. With Wieters likely gone after next season the team will have to trade for a C in a thin market with prospects they can't afford to give up OR promote from within. Max Stassi is a 23 YO that had an above average season at AA last year. He is EXACTLY the kind of legitimate prospect at the right level we would like to have in our system as a potential replacement for Wieters. If he costs us a RP we don't need - and might not want anymore - and a C prospect that would not be a realistic ML option until mid 2017 - if he even proves to be more than a backup - then I would make that trade in a fast minute.
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Re: Orioles Looking For Catcher, Could Deal Troy Patton

PostPost #9 by ofahn » May 19th, 2014, 12:31 pm

osforlife wrote:That proposed trade for Stassi is just unnecessary at this point. While I see the appeal of obtaining a young, almost major league catcher, the catching depth in the organization is the least of Baltimore's worries.

I disagree. IMO IF he's available now for pieces we can afford to give up then I would grab him.

osforlife wrote:A starting catcher is something the O's will worry about in a couple off-seasons. For now, we'll see how the catchers in the organization progress.

Again, I disagree. If the team decides to move him this winter to get some real value for him then a guy like Stassi becomes very important.

osforlife wrote:Can Brian Ward hit AAA pitching? Is Ohlman the real deal? How are the young catchers doing? Is Monell worth keeping? Can Joseph stick at catcher? These are the questions Baltimore's FO should be asking; not "what young catcher should we trade for?" BTW, I'm in favor of trading Matusz over Patton.

I agree with all of your logic EXCEPT the idea of waiting to resolve problems we know are coming.
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Re: Orioles Looking For Catcher, Could Deal Troy Patton

PostPost #10 by osforlife » May 21st, 2014, 7:16 pm

ofahn wrote:I disagree. IMO IF he's available now for pieces we can afford to give up then I would grab him.


Again, I disagree. If the team decides to move him this winter to get some real value for him then a guy like Stassi becomes very important.


I agree with all of your logic EXCEPT the idea of waiting to resolve problems we know are coming.

I agree, it's enticing. But, I see a couple problems;

1. There are potential replacements for Wieters internally. Meanwhile, there are no possible internal solutions for third base when Manny Machado slides over to shortstop. That problem is not only more immediate, but more worrisome. A third basemen would almost have to come from outside of the organization, which means a free agent or a trade. An elite free agent will cost money(that the Orioles spent on Cruz/Jimenez and want to spend on Davis/Machado), or a trade, which will use assets already in the organization. I would worry about that first.

2. Max Stassi could be Houston's catcher of the future. Castro is only under contract through the 2016 season. The next good Astros team will occur after that. Unless Castro is extended, Stassi could make for a potential replacement. Castro could be traded before that too.

3. It might be a waste. Ohlman is starting to pick it up at Bowie, Ward is killing the ball in the minors, Joseph has improved his defense(?), Clevenger can hit. Wieters is still under contract for a little under two years. Baltimore doesn't have to trade him this off-season.

4. I'd say Stassi and Sisco are on similar talent levels, just at a different stage of progression. I doubt they'd trade a good catcher who can contribute in a year for a good catcher that can contribute in three years. Patton would just be a throw in; he's 28, only slightly above average, and will get expensive very soon. Plus he's had a bad off field history.
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Re: Orioles Looking For Catcher, Could Deal Troy Patton

PostPost #11 by Old Sneakers » May 22nd, 2014, 7:40 am

osforlife wrote:1. There are potential replacements for Wieters internally. Meanwhile, there are no possible internal solutions for third base when Manny Machado slides over to shortstop. That problem is not only more immediate, but more worrisome. A third basemen would almost have to come from outside of the organization, which means a free agent or a trade. An elite free agent will cost money(that the Orioles spent on Cruz/Jimenez and want to spend on Davis/Machado), or a trade, which will use assets already in the organization. I would worry about that first.


I've been thinking about this as well. The question of moving Machado to SS. Can he handle it? Durability? Remain a potent Bat for the long term? If the answer to all three is "yes" then this is a huge win for the team. Middle infielders are tough to find.

There really isn't an answer to 3B internally. On that I agree. However, like Chris Davis there are "bats with unrealized potential" out there stuck in the minor leagues or on teams where the player can't succeed. If Baltimore is really considering a move to SS for Machado then scouting out targets like that becomes a priority.

If the team decides a Hardy extension is a bad idea and Machado is the answer then they should make a decision soon. Why waste Machado's most productive and athletic years at a position where his production will be above average at best?
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Re: Orioles Looking For Catcher, Could Deal Troy Patton

PostPost #12 by ljmillar22 » May 24th, 2014, 1:57 pm

Nick Hundley acquired from the padres for Troy Patton.
Lombardozzi recalled from Norfolk
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Re: Orioles Looking For Catcher, Could Deal Troy Patton

PostPost #13 by osforlife » May 27th, 2014, 7:09 pm

Clevenger optioned to Norfolk over Joseph. This is ridiculous.
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Re: Orioles Looking For Catcher, Could Deal Troy Patton

PostPost #14 by Seafordeagles » May 28th, 2014, 2:43 pm

osforlife wrote:Clevenger optioned to Norfolk over Joseph. This is ridiculous.


This from Roch today:

"Clevenger and Brian Ward will handle the catching duties at Norfolk. The Orioles want Clevenger to get regular at-bats and work on his defensive skills, one reason why they optioned him and kept Caleb Joseph as the backup to newly acquired Nick Hundley."
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Re: Orioles Looking For Catcher, Could Deal Troy Patton

PostPost #15 by osforlife » May 29th, 2014, 2:53 pm

Seafordeagles wrote:
This from Roch today:

"Clevenger and Brian Ward will handle the catching duties at Norfolk. The Orioles want Clevenger to get regular at-bats and work on his defensive skills, one reason why they optioned him and kept Caleb Joseph as the backup to newly acquired Nick Hundley."

I understand you did not write that, you're simply copying it, so I'm not arguing with you. But, Clevenger is 28 years old. He's clearly not a prospect. This isn't a situation where we need to give him regular at-bats because a major league stint might ruin his development. Plus, he's played over 130 games at AAA and hit to an .809 OPS. He's in his prime and Baltimore should be inking any production they can get out of him. Joseph is the one that needs minor league at-bats. I'm not saying Clevenger's defense is good, but Joseph's isn't either. Clevenger was doing fine. His OPS is 50 points higher than Hundley's, and it's not even comparable to Joseph's.
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